Just Good Friends ....


Found this on the Bounndless website. Thought it might open up a debate.

Really, this one's for the boys, but us girls should take note.

Enjoy


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BA: Stuck in the Just-Friends Zone by John Thomas

 
DEAR BOUNDLESS ANSWERS

Here's my question — with the focus on relationships lately I thought it would be appropriate. How should a guy deal with being stuck in the "friend-zone"? Here's a hypothetical situation to clarify what I'm talking about.

A guy and a girl are friends. They spend time together one-on-one, and he is always there for her when she needs help — a ride to class, fix her car, listen to her rant about how there are no good guys out there, etc. And therein lies the rub: Because he is such a good friend, she cannot see him as anything more than just a friend. Among my guy friends, the friend-zone is a well-known state. We've all been there at some point or another. We joke that once you are in the friend-zone you might as well be a girl.

Here's my first problem with the whole thing: Shouldn't being a good friend and developing a healthy friendship be the first step towards nurturing a deeper relationship? Yet, so often after all that effort has gone into developing a friendship, we guys find that it's a dead-end. Some guys say that it's on account of being too available or too nice that will leave one stranded in the friend zone.

Here's my second problem with this issue: More often than not, after a guy who is stuck in the friend-zone with a girl has expressed his feelings to her, assuming she rejects him — a likely outcome — the friendship will most likely be lost. It will simply become too awkward with her because she knows that he likes her and that makes her uncomfortable because she only thought of him as a friend. This is basically the story of nice guys everywhere. They're the good friends that girls don't see as anything else, even potentially.

The friend-zone is a black abyss of wasted energies, unmet expectations, disappointment, and awkwardness. Who is at fault? I do not think that guys should be less friendship-centric when approaching a girl. I think that girls should rethink how they view guys they are friends with, and instead of using the nice guys, give them a chance. What do you think?

REPLY

Before I answer your question, I need to make a confession. As early as I can remember noticing that there was an opposite sex (Christie or Misty in Kindergarten was my first love as I recall), I have never understood the whole guy/girl "buddy" thing. Unless I'm forgetting someone, I don't think I've ever had one single "buddy" of the opposite sex. Of course I had friends, but never any relationship of any depth, unless I was interested in pursuing her as a girlfriend.

By "relationship of any depth," I mean a relationship where very much emotional energy was shared. I don't recall going out of my way to make sure that never happened, I'm just saying that, for some reason, it didn't. Maybe I was just a shallow individual, who knows? But my buddies were guys, and the girls with whom I shared emotional energy, I did so in pursuit of a (dating) relationship with them. So, that's my bias as I come to your question.
 
I'm not a big fan of opposite-sex buddies. Boundless has written about this extensively. It has only been in the last few seconds of history that this has really been much of an issue. Historically, opposite-sex relationships have been reserved for guys and girls intent on marriage, or at the very least some kind of romantic (or sexual) pursuit. I can't think of a single Scriptural example of male-female pals. Male-female relationships in Scripture led to either (positively) marriage or (negatively) extra-marital sex, and of course the occasional battle.

But the blurring of gender distinctions over the past few decades has changed all that. At least one of the many negative outcomes of the feminist "men and women are the same" propaganda modern society has swallowed whole is the muddled confusion about guy/girl relationships. "She's just my tennis buddy," he says. "I can always call him when I need someone to talk to," she says. Boys and girls, we're all just the same.


Feminism is an easy target, but I can't lay all the blame there. Communication (or lack thereof) is also to blame. If either of the genders believes that his or her friendship is being used or abused by the opposite sex, that is his or her own responsibility to do something about it. I'm sorry, but I can't blame your female friends for using or abusing your friendship. You are letting them do that. If you're interested in something more than a very, very casual friendship, it's your responsibility to tell her. If she balks, then keep it very, very casual. Don't be there for her emotionally. Let her share her boy troubles with her girlfriends.

My advice is the same to the girls: If he's using you emotionally, but doesn't want to be anything more than casual friends, you're responsible for stopping it. As long as you let that go on you have no one to blame but yourself.

Please don't misunderstand me, emotional friendship is very different than masculine chivalry. There is nothing wrong at all with helping a girl who is in need of a chivalrous act. Chivalry need not die in order to keep gender distinctions from being blurred. For eons, chivalrous men helped women without there being any emotional attachment or expectation. It was part of what defined true manhood. You should be able to distinguish between a girl who has a true need for chivalry and one who is just using you emotionally. Let me be plain: Numerous one-on-one conversations over coffee is not chivalry. Walking her safely to her car from the library is. Being her personal taxi is not chivalry. Changing a flat tire is.

But don't forget: Her need for chivalry is something God uses to help her realize her need for a spouse. Your "being there" for her too much might serve to keep her from realizing her need more quickly — kind of a twist on the old saying, "If the milk is free, why buy the cow?" If you're doing for her most everything she needs a spouse for, what incentive are you giving her to pursue a relationship?

In other words, by your "being there" so much for her, you might be enabling her lack of interest in a serious relationship. She's got plenty of friends and you've got plenty of friends. As soon as you realize she's absolutely not interested in being anything more than "just friends," it's probably a good idea to kindly let her find another chauffeur.

Blessings, JOHN THOMAS * * *
 
If you have a question you'd like John to consider for this column, please send it to editor@boundless.org. Please note that all questions selected for "Boundless Answers" may be edited for clarity and privacy and become the property of Focus on the Family.

Copyright © 2007 John Thomas. All rights reserved. International copyright secured.
Interesting stuff! Angelfire, do you have any wisdom to share on ex's who wanna stay good friends? I'm getting conflicting answers from both girls and guys on this issue, and my head is spinning with guilt that I'm not comfortable with keeping in touch with ex's. What're your thoughts?
Wow! really interesting! Thanks for posting :)
Been here a few times. What us guys may take as an emotional conversation really isn't. Here's a quick list of phrases that girls use way more than guys:

I'm rubbish
I can't do
I'm useless (at)
I'm terrible
I don't know how
I don't have the brains for
etc.

Guys don't tend to say these things. They may think them from time to time, but rarely will say them. Girls say them all the time, regularly flippant in nature. Now, a good Christian will recognise the worth of everyone. As guys only say these things when it's meant, a Christian guy notices when a girl says them and may well offer encouragement to reinforce the fact that she isn't useless. Girls like being told they're useful and good at stuff, just like guys. So they'll keep talking to the guy.

These times are particularly poignant when it comes to the girl is thinking about doing something like asking work for time off or trying to get through a busy period. If a guy talks to me about this then one of the following usually work to get him going again

'You wont get if you don't ask.'
'It's tough for everyone.'
'All you need to do is pass.'
'You're good at it.'

I found that for girls it tends to be the above (Repeat x 10). Unsurprisingly girls like guys who are supportive and come back for more. The guy thinks it's special but it's not. You're just 'really good to talk to'.
Well... yes, but I do think girls (myself included) can be guilty of relying on guy-friends for emotional support, sometimes to an inappropriate extent. As Angelfire quotes in the text above, phrases like "there are no good guys out there" are quite common, as is asking for advice on relationships.

I don't think there's anything wrong with getting a perspective on things from the opposite sex, or on having good friendships with members of the opposite sex, but there does need to be a line drawn I think.

Now that I'm married (though I think it also applies to any "serious" relationship) I wouldn't talk to a guy friend about any marital problems or arguments we were having for example, though I might ask what I should get him for Christmas. And engage in conversation on any number of other less emotional topics!

I just don't think it's appropriate or wise to have that kind of emotional involvement with any man besides my husband, and I'm sure he wouldn't like it if I did (I know I wouldn't if he were asking a female friend for advice or comfort). It would feel kind of similar to dressing up to see them, or seeing them one-on-one without my husband's knowledge. Mixed signals, shaky territory. I think the author is right in advising guys not to be there emotionally for a girl who is only supposed to be a friend.

Secondary to that is the habit of some girls of continually putting themselves down in order to get affirmation. Sometimes of course they are genuinely looking for a confidence boost, which is understandable. But it's not fair to have a guy friend on standby anytime you're feeling a bit low who will tell you how wonderful you are, especially if you're then going to act surprised and disappointed if it transpires that he feels something more for you than friendship. It's emotionally selfish and, again, mixed signals.

Besides, emotional support and advice are what girlfriends are for. Girls rock, and will always bring chocolate.
Very interesting reading!

Over the years my views have changed on this matter somewhat. I used to think it was fine have a really close male friend, until I realised that with many of the guys I became close 'buddies' with I often fell for, or had a unhealthy emotional attachment to. When they ended up getting a girlfriend, I would be slightly jealous, even though I may not have wanted to date them myself. I guess you could say that I wanted to have my cake and eat it.

I agree that we need to keep a distance in girl/guy relationships unless for the pursuit of dating/marriage. From a girls point of view, it certainly doesn't do us any good to rely on a man that only wants to be friends. My heart has been damaged too many times in these circumstances!

And Caz is right, girls rock for emotional support! We girls need to invest in these more. And likewise, men with men! xx
Yeah. Let men support me emotionally through the joy of Northern Ireland beating Sweden and topping the group!
This is really interesting and I've also changed my views over the years. Being a tomboy growing up I had more guy friends than girls but that was because I played football with them and didn't want to talk about the mushy stuff.
I like talking about the mushy stuff now and it's better to do that with girls ;o)

I had a couple of really close guy friends a couple of years ago and I felt God strongly say I needed to stop seeing them in one to one settings as they had become almost step in boyfriends (without the benefits). Six months after that revelation and uncomfortable obedience I met my now fiance.
Mixed bag. I don't get along with most girls. Wel,l I do, but we don't talk on the same level most of the time because i can only be interested in bags/shoes/haircuts for so long and then need some seriously stimulating and/or funny stuff to talk about.

I have a very good guy friend who gives great advice, and we established from the word Go that we both just wanted to be good friends who could talk about stuff, and that has not changed over the few years we've been friends. I didn't, then did, then didn't have a boyfriend while he and I have been friends and it's been fine. He is now interested in another friend of mine, and I'm fine with it.

I'm sure there will come a time when some of the stuff we talk about will change and be directed at the ppl we end up going out with/marrying etc. Having a right understanding, and maintaining honesty and integrity is what every friendship should reflect, regardless of male/female.

Please note I'm not bashing what anyone has said here, just making a few observations of my own whilst thinking about points raised here :)
That is so great to hear Jen, I was starting to get worried about a friendship with Jai who I consider one of my bestest mates. We've gone over the whole 'we're friends right?' thing a zillion times just to make sure, ha ha ;) And we've both been in relationships while we've known eachother. I'd say we don't talk as much about personal stuff since his serious girlfriend became a definite thing. I talk to my girlfriends and sisters more about it, it's just naturally gone that way. But I know for sure I can ring him up anytime I need for advice and a listening ear, I know he won't judge me and is always gonna be there for me if I need.

However, a friendship with a guy of late has gone slightly to pot as he now has feelings for me. So this has thrown everything into confusion again! argh! That said, we were definitely friends in the beginning and were clear about that, always honest from the start. That's all you can be, honest. I just didn't read the signs, but there's not much I can do about it now.

I think you can only be yourself, always honest and open with eachother. If you're both on the same wavelength I honestly think a friendship with a guy can work. Like you say, I believe those conversations you have with eachother will naturally turn to the person you end up with/marrying. And if they don't naturally, i think we have to make a conscious effort to.

Rxx
Jen, I think (and hope!) that you're being tongue-in-cheek about girls only talking about shoes, bags and hair. If not, then it's a bit worrying that you think only guys can offer you stimulating conversation or wit, and a bit sad if that has been your experience of female friendships...

Ray, of course there is nothing wrong with having close male friends, I think it's just a question of boundaries. For example, if you and Jai are just friends, why have you had to keep reaffirming this? And how might a boyfriend of yours or a girlfriend of his feel about how close you two are if they knew that you had discussed this? Or were discussing them? Or talking things through with each other instead of with them?

Surely if you're in a relationship, it's the person you're with with whom you should be sharing your thoughts, hopes, fears, with whom you should be building trust and intimacy and letting yourself be known?

But you're probably both right that when a serious relationship develops it will naturally go that way anyway...